The Mystery of the Rapture Reveiled

Paul goes to a great extent to explain the mystery in 1 Cor. 15. The return of Christ is first mentioned in verse 24. The body of his message is to explain and debunk the teachings of the Saducees. The Saducees believe that there is no spirit, no angels, nor resurrection… see Acts. 23:8. So here in this passage Paul is explaining that we indeed have a spirit body and a Earthly/natural body. Often Paul discusses this fact in other Scriptures, “to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.” There is no need for a Earth suit in heaven. Yet so many miss the nature of the mystery that Paul is explaining. The mystery is not about the rapture (being caught up), but rather about the resurrection of the dead (see vs.44), and what happens to the Earth suit (physical body/ natural man).

In Acts 2 we are informed that Jesus natural body did not become “corrupted” in the grave. In other words it didn’t rot and decay. This was prophesied in the Old Testament. So we are made to understand that Paul is talking about the dead saints who’s bodies have become corrupted by rotting and decaying. Paul is stating that we will not all “sleep.” This means that we will not all come to rest in the grave by dying. Those who are alive (and remain) will change in a moment from mortality to immortality. This is the exact opposite of what happened to Adam at the fall when he sinned. He changed from immortality to being mortal. Death entered into the World through sin. Prior to sin Adam’s “Earth suit” could not die.

Paul calls this event the “resurrection of the dead.” He also informs us that the dead saints will again get new natural bodies that cannot be corrupted, rot, or decay. This is the mystery that Paul is referring to in this passage. The reason that the dead saints will need a new physical body is because Jesus is not going to rule and reign for 1000 years on Earth. Without a natural body, the dead saints would be disembodied spirits running around at this time with no Earth suit.

John informs us in Rev. 20:4,5 that those who get martyred for not taking the Mark of the Beast will be resurrected at the FIRST resurrection. 1 Cor 15:42-54 speaks of this same first resurrection.

Acts 1:9-12 informs us that Jesus will return in “like manner” of that He left. He left from the Mount of Olives to the sky/clouds to heaven. If He returns in “like manner” then He will come from heaven with all His (dead) saints to the sky/clouds (1 Thess. 4:16,17, Matt. 24:29-31 where we meet Him in the air) to the Mount of Olives (Zech 14:4,5 with all of His saints).

Earthly bodies never go to heaven. When John was told to “come up here…” he was immediately in the spirit…. Rev. 4:1,2. At the time of the resurrection we will be changed, but the word “glorified” bodies are not used by Paul to describe our new Earth suits (natural bodies).

 

Separating the Rapture from the Second Coming

A post tribber was having a conversation with a pretribber.  The post states to the pre, “I’m going golfing next week on Tuesday.”  The pre responds, “Is that the first Tuesday or the second Tuesday next week?”  The post states, “What?  What do you mean by that?” The pre responds, “Well the first Tuesday of the week we call the rapture, and the second Tuesday we call the second coming.”  The post responds, “That sounds a little schizophrenic to me.  How do you come up with that?”   The pre replies, “Well the first Tuesday is the day of the Lord and the second is the day of Christ.”  Again the post replies, “Say what?  Christ is the Lord!  There is no difference.”

I’ve been amazed at how the pre-trib camp has attempted to separate the singular event of the rapture/second coming.  The very word “rapture” isn’t in the Bible, yet it was conjured up as an attempt to bring a separation in the event.  They make these big long list or charts to attempt to explain the difference.  Some reasonings are all out lies.  For example:  We are told that at the second coming Jesus doesn’t meet us in the air, but heads strait for the Mount of Olives.  However, Matt. 24:29-31 which is a known as a second coming Scripture, informs us that Jesus comes in the clouds and gathers His own.  So then the argument must then separate the clouds (Matt 24:29-31) from the air (1 Thess. 4:16,17).  That has no more argument than attempting to separate ‘the day of the Lord’ from ‘the day of Christ’.  Both are the same.  We are told that at the second coming Christ’s own are gathered, but at the rapture, we simple meet Him in the air.  However, 2 Thess. 2:1 defines the rapture as being “gathered together with Him…”  In the end no distinction can be made.  Yet this is the very foundation of the pretrib belief.

For further proof see the posts concerning 2 events of “like a thief…”

The Scripture tells us EXACTLY when the Rapture will occure.

The reason there are so many views concerning the coming of our Lord and our gathering together with Him is due to the amount of speculation.  The truth of the matter is that the Scripture tells us exactly when and how the Rapture will occur.

Paul tells us that the rapture will occur “at the last trumpet.”  1 Cor. 15:51,52.  He describes it as a mystery. The angel declares that at the last trumpet the mystery of God is finished… Rev. 10:7. At the last trumpet, Jesus rules and reigns forevermore… Rev. 11:15.  At the last trumpet Jesus judges the dead, and REWARDS the righteous…. Rev. 11:18. Jesus declares that when He comes, that His REWARD is WITH Him… Rev. 22:12.

Are you getting that?

—-At the last trumpet Jesus comes … 1 Cor. 15:51,52

—-At the 7th trumpet Jesus rewards the righteous, and judges the dead… Rev. 11:18

—-Jesus rewards the righteous and the wicked according to their works when He comes…Rev. 22:12

—-Paul reveals a mystery at the last trumpet… 1 Cor. 15:51,52

—-The angel declares that at the 7th trumpet, the mystery is finished… Rev. 10:7

But the Scripture doesn’t end there…

The angel swore that time was no more… Rev. 10:6.   Jesus rules and reigns forevermore…Rev. 11:15, and that the mystery of God is finished…Rev. 10:7. At this point, there simply cannot have Jesus ruling and reigning forevermore and then have a chronological timing of the beast making war on the saints 2 chapters later. The fact remains that the angel told John that he would prophesy again…Rev. 10:11. At this point we can understand that the trumpets and the bowls are the same events….Note the dual nature of the prophesies. The seas are made fowl..2nd and 3rd trumpet AND bowl… 4th trumpet and bowl the sun is effected, some experience darkness, while others get scorched by the sun. 5th trumpet and bowl From the pit of darkness that cause severe pain… . 6th trumpet and bowl, Euphrates river mentioned which causes a great war and loss of lives. The seventh trumpet and bowl is the rapture…trumpet 1 Cor. 15:51,52, Rev. 10:6,7, 11:15-18,22:12, bowl.. Rev. 16:15. Paul declares it at the last trumpet (1 Cor. 15:51,52). Jesus declares it at the last bowl (Rev. 16:15), and the angel tells John that there is a dual prophesy (Rev. 10:11).

As you can clearly see, Scripture addresses the WHEN of the rapture.  It is at the end of the tribulation.  All other views use speculation in an attempt to place the rapture at different points concerning the tribulation.  Those attempts do not have any Scripture to back their claims.

Speculation of the pre-trib view Verses the Grounded Word of the Post-trib view

2 Timothy 2:23 states, “But refuse foolish and ignorant speculations, knowing that they produce quarrels” or schisms..

No one refutes that there is schisms in the body of Christ over the correct placement of the rapture. Paul tells Timothy to avoid speculations for this very reason. The key would seem then to analyze the Word of God to see if one view is truly built on speculation:

Comparing the Scriptural foundations of the pre-trib rapture vs. the Scriptural foundations of the post trib view:

Pre-tribulation Rapture Scriptural Support

The biggest argument for placement of the rapture of the pre-trib doctrine is the fact that we are not “appointed to wrath.” 1 Thess. 5:9. Because of this argument it absolutely makes since that the rapture would have to take place prior to God’s wrath. So here we understand that the timing of the rapture is given according to the logical reasoning that seems to make since. However, when looking for an actual Scripture to support the claim that the rapture takes place prior to the great tribulation, there is none to be found. If you know of one that pinpoints the rapture prior to the tribulation, please post below. Therefore the foundation of the pretrib view becomes a matter of precepts that are built upon logical conclusions. As a result of a lack of a single Scripture to support the timing of a rapture prior to the tribulation, there are multiple accusations that the pretrib rapture is not in the Bible, because of this. Often this is taken to believe that the accusation is that the rapture itself is not in the Bible. That argument is easily debunked. Of course, the rapture is in the Bible. What is in question is the placement prior to the tribulation that is in question.

So at this point we currently only have an assumption based upon speculation.

The problem with the logical conclusions is, that they are based upon an assumption of what the wrath of God is. Although Rev. 14:9-11 informs us that God’s wrath is Hell, and Rev. 11:15-18 tells us that God’s wrath judges the dead after Jesus rules and reigns forevermore. The assumption remains that God’s wrath is temporal in nature and not Hell. It is true that MAN declares that God’s wrath has come in Rev. 6:16,17, but both Jesus and Paul tells us to let no MAN deceive us. So we still have a mixed message… Is God actually stating that His wrath started at this point in the book of Revelation (Rev. 6:16,17) or is it simply the claim of men? The correct interpretation hinges on whether on not God’s wrath is temporal or remains an eternal Hell.

Let’s look at the application: If God’s wrath is temporal and God’s people are not appointed to it, then why are the “tribulation saints” missing the promise? God is not a man that He should lie. If God’s wrath is and eternal Hell, then God’s promise applies to the “tribulation saints” as well. For they too are not appointed to Hell (wrath). Another thing to consider is what ARE we appointed to? Often verse 10 is left out in 1 Thess. 5:9, AND 10. We are appointed to SALVATION and FOREVER living with Him. So our appointment is eternal in nature… interesting. Why is the word “appointment” or “assignment” used here? Those words often are used for a futurist position. When someone is appointed or assigned something it often has a futuristic due date where it becomes reality. It’s amazing the tribulation some of our brothers and sisters have to endure around the world. So serious that often we can’t stand to even hear about it. Yet, they know their assignment is Eternal and that Jesus overcame. That’s what brings them “peace” and “good cheer” in the trial…John 16:33

So often man who is affixed to Earth has his mind on the things of Earth. It is difficult to grasp the reality of the eternal, but with God, He is not temporal minded. And earthquake of Tsunami can instantly kill thousands, and man can call it God’s wrath. A Saint who has spent their life serving God, can end up dying a long agonizing death of cancer. We know that their appointment is heaven, yet it’s ridiculous to consider temporal death God’s wrath. Judgement Yes. God’s judgement brings about His eternal wrath.

We are not appointed to wrath… 1 Thess. 5:9 The word for wrath in the Greek is “ergo” It is only used 5 times in Revelations… 6:16,17, and 11:18(at the last trumpet) 16:19 (at the last bowl) and 19:15 (same event at the last trumpet/last bowl) .

In conclusion, the timing of the rapture for the pre-trib view is based entirely upon speculation.
Scriptural basis for the Post-trib rapture

Paul tells us that the rapture is at the last trumpet… 1 Cor. 15:51,52. This gives us a timing to work with:

51] Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
[52] In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

The angel declares the same mystery at the 7th trumpet:

Rev. 10:
[7] But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets

This verse is never brought up when people attempt to debunk the last trumpet concept. The argument is directed only on chapter 11 of Rev. when the trumpet is actually blown. It is very interesting that the angel declares the word mystery. These verse… 1 Cor. 15,51,52, and Rev. 10:7 are the only verses in the Scripture that mention the mystery of God and the last trumpet. The debunkers attempt to show a ruse of other trumpet verses in the old testament that clearly don’t apply.

But that is not all…

At the 7th trumpet, Rev. 11:15-18, Jesus rules and reigns forevermore. He rewards the righteous….

HELLO!

Rev. 22:12 [12] “And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be”

Did you catch that??? His reward is WITH Him when He comes…. At the 7th trumpet He REWARDS every man..

But that’s not all…

When the angel gives John the little book to eat, He swears that time “is no more,” and puts it in the context of the 7th trumpet.

Rev. 10:
[5] And the angel which I saw stand upon the sea and upon the earth lifted up his hand to heaven,
[6] And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:
[7] But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

What is the purpose of John eating the book? To what end? It’s found in the last verse:

[11] And he said unto me, Thou must prophesy again before many peoples, and nations, and tongues, and kings

That is a huge commission to someone in their 90’s if he was near the age of Christ when called as a disciple. This vision/ heavenly experience took place in 92 to 95 AD on the island of Patmos while in exile. He spent the rest of his days in Ephesus where he finished the final draft of Revelations and the book of John. He died without any record of prophesying to many peoples, nations and tongues…. EXCEPT…

Understanding the nature of the seventh trumpet:

1. Time is no more… Rev. 10:6
2. Jesus rules and reigns forevermore… Rev. 11:15-18
3. God wrath IS come, judges the dead… Rev. 11:15-18
4. Jesus rewards the righteous… Rev. 11:15-18
5. God destroys them that destroy the Earth… Rev. 11:15-18
6. Paul declares the Rapture happens at the last trumpet…. 1 Cor. 15:51,52

If Jesus now rules and reigns forevermore and God destroys those that destroy the Earth, then you simply cannot have an antichrist ruling and reigning chronologically after this.
Throughout the book of Revelation the angels/beast/voice from heaven are showing John the revelation and walking him through it, until you get to a section of chapters 12-16. In this section no personal guidance is supplied to him through it. In this section we have the mark of the beast, and the seven bowl/vials judgments. The angel does not return to explain and expound on this section until chapter 17. We know that Jesus rules and reigns forevermore at the end of chapter eleven and therefore this section cannot be happening post 7th trumpet, but rather must be a parallel, or a SECOND prophesy. John prophesying AGAIN. The angel told John that he would prophesy AGAIN as a result of eating the little book. Therefore the ONLY explanation is that the 12-16 chapters is exactly that; John prophesying again. This second prophesy originates from eating the book. John never had the opportunity to prophesy again to many tribes, nations and kings after his time of exile on Patmos. He was an old man and died shortly afterward. However, this second prophesy IS and will be heard by all the kings, nations, and tribes, when the mark of the beast is implemented and they start wondering why the Saints won’t play along and take the mark. The second prophesy mirrors the first. The seven bowls expound on it’s sister prophesy, the seven trumpets. They are one in the same.

That being the case, check out right before the seventh bowl. Jesus declares in Rev. 16:15 its in red!

“Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame

This is the same warning He gave the CHURCH of Sardis in Rev. 3:1-4. (Why is the church being mentioned in chapter 16?)

So here we see Paul declaring that the rapture is at the last trumpet. We see Jesus declaring that the rapture is about to happen right before the last bowl, and we have the Angel showing John that the trumpets and the bowls are one in the same. Jesus rewards the righteous at the 7th trumpet, and declares He comes and His reward is WITH Him.

There is at least three Scriptures that directly point to the rapture at the 7th trumpet. The view is not built upon speculation, but the Word of God

Pretrib doctrine is Foundationaly built on Speculation of obscure passages part 1

I find it fascinating that a pre-trib doctrine believer actually believes that some prophesies are fulfilled. After all the most obvious fulfillment is the one where the daily sacrifices have ended, and pretribbers see it as futuristic. The Jews know when these sacrifices ended, the rest of the world knows that the Jews have never continued to resume the daily sacrifices, and yet pre-tribbers place this prophesy in the future. Interesting…

Titus who made a covenant with the Roman Empire started his quest in 66 AD to squelch the Jewish rebellion. After 3.5 years his quest ended by the decimation of the temple in Jerusalem. Thus ending the daily sacrifices and leaving Jerusalem desolate. This happened in chronological order of Daniel’s prophesy of the 70 weeks. Right after the Messiah was cut off by not for Himself, thus fulfilling Daniel’s 70th week to a T… YET…the pretribber tells us that there is a mysterious 2000 yr +/- gap between the 69th and 70 week. Just so that the Great Tribulation can be a 7 yr period, and so they can falsely separate the Jewish program from the church. What do they do with the daily sacrifices being obviously cut off? They tell us that the Temple is going to be rebuilt and the daily sacrifices again restored…. YET… the whole of Scripture NEVER gives any indication of that. In fact this thinking is brought about by a single verse…. Daniel’s 70th week which Titus clearly fulfilled in a timely manor.

This single verse that is falsely interpreted by the pretrib doctrine is the Foundation of the pretrib doctrine. Without it you have no 7 year tribulation period, no temple rebuilt, no mid-tribulation 3.5 year timeline, no end of the daily sacrifices, and the like. ONE SINGLE VERSE, and NO SUPPORTING VERSES to support it. The entire doctrine is built on such speculation of obscure passages that don’t support the doctrine. Sad part is that pretribbers want it to work so badly for them that they forsake the truth just to make it work for them. It is extremely sad the deception that they have brought upon themselves because they fail to love the truth… 2 Thess. 2:11,12

Peter actually warns us of the Pre-tribulation Rapture Lie

Peter was there when Jesus gave the Olivet Discourse (Matt. 24, Mark 13, Luke 21). 

Peter later traveled with Paul to the gentiles.  (Book of Acts)

Peter taught the same message to the gentiles that Jesus taught the Jews.  (2 Peter 3)

The Pretrib view makes it case from Paul’s writings and declares a separation of the church and Israel, and declares a separation between the rapture and second coming. 

Paul’s writings to the gentiles gives opportunity for people to twist the Scriptures. 

Peter addresses this:  2 Peter 3:10-16

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a great noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up. 11 Therefore, since all these things will be dissolved, what manner of persons ought you to be in holy conduct and godliness, 12 looking for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be dissolved, being on fire, and the elements will melt with fervent heat? 13 Nevertheless we, according to His promise, look for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells. 14 Therefore, beloved, looking forward to these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, without spot and blameless; 15 and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation–as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

Myriad

Myriad

A myriad is literally the number ten thousand; in that sense, the term is used almost exclusively in translations from Greek, Latin, or Chinese, or when talking about ancient Greek numbers. Wikipedia

Other sources say the same definition of Myriad that ancient sources always meant 10,000.  Today the word can mean as little as a handful or bunch, to infinity. If however this word meant 10,000 when Jude wrote his book as Wikipedia says, it puts a quick end to the pretrib doctrine .

Jude 14 is the famous quote from the Enoch the 7th from Adam, we are told when Jesus returns He will return with 10,000s of His saints.  We can only speculate how many millions of saints have gone before us and are ready and waiting to return with Christ for His bride.

I know that rubs the pretrib doctrine, but check out another verse.  Paul is speaking of the bride being made ready here on Earth so she can be presentable to the Father, when Jesus comes with the rest of His saints 1 Thess. 3:12,13.

This parallels Rev. 19, and removes the confusion that comes with the pretrib doctrine that assumes the bride is already in heaven.   The Word in Rev. 19 says, that she has made herself ready, and the location of where she has made herself ready is assumed.  It’s a good thing we have the rest of the Word to remove those nasty assumptions.

The post-trib view doesn’t need myriad to mean what it does, but it is imperative to the pretrib that it doesn’t have a number.  Best for the pretrib view to avoid 1 Thess. 3:13 altogether.

I attempted further research concerning the quote from Enoch. Not yet finding the exact quote, but fasinating book, prophesies fulfillment of the world’s events from beginning of time to the end.  It also address the time segment of “weeks” that seem to stumble so many doctorates of theology concerning Daniel.   It is interesting in chapter 100 how it tells us that God’s angels will protect His own in the coming time of Judgement.